So if Superman is an immigrant what does/did that make Zod and his compatriots?

Space Invaders?

TC, what is the likelihood that these major embargo-breaking reviews/reactions are with the silent approval of Warner Brothers?

CheeseSndwch said:

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So if Superman is an immigrant what does/did that make Zod and his compatriots?

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Venezuelans?

Claude! said:

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TC, what is the likelihood that these major embargo-breaking reviews/reactions are with the silent approval of Warner Brothers?

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I'm guessing the positive ones are haha

AgfromHOU said:

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Art is subjective. Even blockbusters are "art" because of all of the steps involved in making it, from creative writing to the composition of a shot/frame.

If the "fan base" loves Superman so much, they should already know what Superman is (an alien immigrant), and what was said isn't a problem. Maybe they shouldn't be snowflakes about it and get offended by "political" or "immigrant". If anything, Superman is the ultimate positive immigrant story, with him achieving the American Dream and being a representation of what America thinks it is. The problem is that isn't what America is, and that's what is creating this "controversy".

You want someone of opposite views to keep their mouth shut, but if it's the same as yours I would doubt you say the same thing.

Even Superman 1978 is political and examines American ideals in a time of hyper individualism and distrust in the government.

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To harken way back to 2006, I'm looking forward to the ****-show if they have changed the line that has long been associated with Superman - truth, justice, and the American way. I believe in Superman Returns, they replaced "the American way" with "and all that stuff", something like that. What are the odds that this phrase will be changed for this new movie?

Yes, I am aware that Superman has been portrayed as non-American (at least once) in Red Son, where the son of Jor-El crashed into the Soviet Union and was raised as a commie Russian. But that's a one-off alternate reality kind of show, not Superman as the public knows him - an alien child who crashes in Kansas USA and grows up to be an American protector first, but also a world protector.

Quad Dog said:

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He's got the black kid standing way in the back and he's about to snap the Asian kid's neck.

The Original Houston 1836 said:

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Quad Dog said:

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He's got the black kid standing way in the back and he's about to snap the Asian kid's neck.

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I'm more concerned about the poindexter ginger right next to him.

The phrase has already been changed to "truth, justice, and a better tomorrow" by DC to reflect Superman representing humanity/the world instead of just America

Looks like the references to him as an illegal alien / immigrant have filled the comics at least since 2017.
Lois Lane comic from 2020




Superman helping his fellow illegals not get murdered in 2017



Also here's Superman violating the constitutional freedom of these men celebrating Halloween by dressing up like ghosts.

Of course that all coincides with trump 45 and the political left getting up in arms about immigration. Surely that was just happenstance.

AgfromHOU said:

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If the "fan base" loves Superman so much, they should already know what Superman is (an alien immigrant), and what was said isn't a problem.

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If the "fan base" loves Star Wars so much, they should already know what it is, what the force is, and have no problems with The Last Jedi...

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Maybe they shouldn't be snowflakes about it and get offended by "political" or "immigrant". If anything, Superman is the ultimate positive immigrant story, with him achieving the American Dream and being a representation of what America thinks it is. The problem is that isn't what America is, and that's what is creating this "controversy".

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Being a "snowflake" is also subjective. The finger wagging at current issues being brought up by entertainers can also be considered "snowflake" as well - just as people are free to express the same about audiences who voice strong opinions about it the other way. And the idea that America isn't pro-immigrant unless it has as few restrictions as possible (which is the heart of the angst behind pushing this kind of message) is also subjective. The "proper" position someone should take on this issue might not also be accurately represented, just because those with the mic might passionately feel that way.

I think taking a fictional character like Superman and trying too hard to bend him to fit modern social commentary on either side to me cheapens the story and the original intent.

It would be nice if we could have some art that inspired in a positive way instead of a judging way. But people take it and bend it to what they think it should say to others...when if you simply presented it without any commentary I would imagine most audiences would interpret things differently - but hopefully in a positive and inspirational way.

I don't have a problem with the movie, and hope it's a good story that's positive. I think Gunn is a very talented director. I'm also not interested in equating a fantasy character with the more complicated realities of the world and policy...because it's not something that can be summed up in a soundbite or a fictional character that doesn't exist.

Claude! said:

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TC, what is the likelihood that these major embargo-breaking reviews/reactions are with the silent approval of Warner Brothers?

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IMO, the sources so far seem a little too random, and a little too vague, to be silently studio-approved, but who knows.

Otherwise, just FYI, the reactions dropping late tonight will be from fans and critics alike, i.e. not part of a controlled rollout by the studio, or from only the premiere, etc. Yes, they'll include reactions from the premiere tonight, and a couple of early, studio-sponsored fan screenings as well, but will also be from everyone else, including just about every critic, who has either seen the movie over the past couple of weeks or is seeing it tonight for the first time.

And fair warning, seeing as how crucial the reactions will be to the summer box office, the future of the DCU, etc, I'll be posting quite a few of them here tonight (the embargo lifts at 11 PM Central). I'll try to stick to trusted critics/personalities, but can't promise anything. Just a heads up to the two or three people who get irrationally bent out of shape by having to scroll past tweets on their phone.

THIS JUST IN: we’ve got our hands on this confidential conversation between billionaire Lex Luthor and government officials being candid about their feelings toward Superman. Sure, the focus is just on our alien friend today, but who’s to say it won’t be on another meta-human… pic.twitter.com/RChTZ9jVbr

— DCU Updates (@DCU_Updates) July 7, 2025

Superman is a character created by two second generation Jewish immigrants in 1938.

He has always been a reflection of whatever modern society needed him to be and an allegory for modern issues for 87 years.

Literally in his first comic he fights a wife beater and a crooked Senator. The "American Way" saying was added in 1952 for the original TV show during the Red Scare. His radio show helped fight the KKK. Silver Age Superman was even more progressive. He wrote on the Moon for all to see "Do good to others and every man can be a Superman."

FL_Ag1998 said:

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Cougar11 said:

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man libs ruined another movie was going to see this, now no.

As a kid watching superman never thought oh hes an immigrant so stupid.

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Says a guy who has 1 other post on this board but rushed over from F16 to let us know he's definitely not going to see this now.

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does that upset you? My posting habitats are not germane to this discussion.




lol

Cinco Ranch Aggie said:

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Serious Lee said:

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for once, it wasnt F16 that made it political. NPC doesn't care

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Apparently it is verboten that any one who has/does post on F16 is not allowed to post when a movie director makes a political statement about his upcoming movie.

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its amazing isn't like there are unwritten rules about who can post on this board. laughable.

So he's a mysoginist?

Thanks for the heads up.

Quad Dog said:

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Superman is a character created by two second generation Jewish immigrants in 1938.

He has always been a reflection of whatever modern society needed him to be and an allegory for modern issues for 87 years.

Literally in his first comic he fights a wife beater and a crooked Senator. The "American Way" saying was added in 1952 for the original TV show during the Red Scare. His radio show helped fight the KKK. Silver Age Superman was even more progressive. He wrote on the Moon for all to see "Do good to others and every man can be a Superman."

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How dare you bring facts and not feelings to this thread.

Quad Dog said:

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Superman is a character created by two second generation Jewish immigrants in 1938.

He has always been a reflection of whatever modern society needed him to be and an allegory for modern issues for 87 years.

Literally in his first comic he fights a wife beater and a crooked Senator. The "American Way" saying was added in 1952 for the original TV show during the Red Scare. His radio show helped fight the KKK. Silver Age Superman was even more progressive. He wrote on the Moon for all to see "Do good to others and every man can be a Superman."

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you are conflating those positions with modern day progressivism.

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They've removed the "American Way" portion of the line in the film. They replaced it with "and the good" or some crap.

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is this true if so wow?

Cougar11 said:

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Cinco Ranch Aggie said:

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Serious Lee said:

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for once, it wasnt F16 that made it political. NPC doesn't care

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Apparently it is verboten that any one who has/does post on F16 is not allowed to post when a movie director makes a political statement about his upcoming movie.

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its amazing isn't like there are unwritten rules about who can post on this board. laughable.

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What's laughable, and germane to the topic of people getting their panties in a bunch (which is what we're discussing), is you almost never post on this board yet after seeing a generalized statement by the director you rush over here to virtue signal that you're not going to see the movie.

You can watch the Superman Red Carpet World Premiere here starting at 6:30 pm CT:

Quad Dog said:

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Superman is a character created by two second generation Jewish immigrants in 1938.

He has always been a reflection of whatever modern society needed him to be and an allegory for modern issues for 87 years.

Literally in his first comic he fights a wife beater and a crooked Senator. The "American Way" saying was added in 1952 for the original TV show during the Red Scare. His radio show helped fight the KKK. Silver Age Superman was even more progressive. He wrote on the Moon for all to see "Do good to others and every man can be a Superman."

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Those are very clear-cut issues though. Good vs. evil. And his character was a great way to showcase that.

Trying to use him for subjective social commentary today isn't a good idea IMO and it cheapens the character.

Gigem314 said:

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Quad Dog said:

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Superman is a character created by two second generation Jewish immigrants in 1938.

He has always been a reflection of whatever modern society needed him to be and an allegory for modern issues for 87 years.

Literally in his first comic he fights a wife beater and a crooked Senator. The "American Way" saying was added in 1952 for the original TV show during the Red Scare. His radio show helped fight the KKK. Silver Age Superman was even more progressive. He wrote on the Moon for all to see "Do good to others and every man can be a Superman."

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Those are very clear-cut issues though. Good vs. evil. And his character was a great way to showcase that.

Trying to use him for subjective social commentary today isn't a good idea IMO and it cheapens the character.

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I agree with this, and that's why I hope that the movie sticks with the generalized sentiment of treating others with respect and kindness, and veers away from pointed current political statements. But the point is I'm willing to see the actual movie first before I start performative raging.
.

FL_Ag1998 said:

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Cougar11 said:

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Cinco Ranch Aggie said:

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Serious Lee said:

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for once, it wasnt F16 that made it political. NPC doesn't care

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Apparently it is verboten that any one who has/does post on F16 is not allowed to post when a movie director makes a political statement about his upcoming movie.

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its amazing isn't like there are unwritten rules about who can post on this board. laughable.

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What's laughable, and germane to the topic of people getting their panties in a bunch (which is what we're discussing), is you almost never post on this board yet after seeing a generalized statement by the director you rush over here to virtue signal that you're not going to see the movie.

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whats laughable is you are concerned about where and when I post, calm down man its just a message board.

Talk about your panties getting in a bunch

Gigem314 said:

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Quad Dog said:

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Superman is a character created by two second generation Jewish immigrants in 1938.

He has always been a reflection of whatever modern society needed him to be and an allegory for modern issues for 87 years.

Literally in his first comic he fights a wife beater and a crooked Senator. The "American Way" saying was added in 1952 for the original TV show during the Red Scare. His radio show helped fight the KKK. Silver Age Superman was even more progressive. He wrote on the Moon for all to see "Do good to others and every man can be a Superman."

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Those are very clear-cut issues though. Good vs. evil. And his character was a great way to showcase that.

Trying to use him for subjective social commentary today isn't a good idea IMO and it cheapens the ex\character.

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Exactly

Quad Dog said:

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Superman is a character created by two second generation Jewish immigrants in 1938.

He has always been a reflection of whatever modern society needed him to be and an allegory for modern issues for 87 years.

Literally in his first comic he fights a wife beater and a crooked Senator. The "American Way" saying was added in 1952 for the original TV show during the Red Scare. His radio show helped fight the KKK. Silver Age Superman was even more progressive. He wrote on the Moon for all to see "Do good to others and every man can be a Superman."

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Let's take these in order.

1. The overwhelming majority of so-called "progressives" in this country are utterly anti-Jewish, and it's not even debatable.

2. The overwhelming majority of so-called "progressives" in this country fully supported a male violently beating the **** out of a woman in a boxing ring, just because said male decided that he was a woman in his mind.

3. The so-called "progressives" in this country willingly put members of the Clinton family and the Biden family up as candidates in the last three presidential elections. I don't need to go through the full list because Burisma and the Clinton Foundation alone have exemplified more obvious corruption out of so-called "progressives" than we have ever seen out of anyone on the other side of the aisle.

4. So-called "progressives" in this country are the only ones openly advocating for race-based discrimination, and the party of the so-called "progressives" is the one that founded the KKK.

5. So-called "progressives" in this country are the driving force behind cancel culture: if a person sins against the arbitrary moving target of leftist ideals, they are not treated with dignity and no good is done to them. They are ostracized, humiliated, threatened, and insulted until the mob grows tired and moves on. There is no forgiveness in modern so-called "progressivism." Also, modern so-called "progressivism" is morally relativistic. There is no foundation for such a thing as "good" or "evil." Good has no meaning beyond whatever is politically expedient for the "progressive" agenda. There can be no "good" done because what is "good" is fluid and therefore meaningless.

Nothing about Superman has anything to do with modern so-called "progressivism."

Something about pots and kettles comes to mind re, the politics there. The right isn't as any more righteous than the left, even in the issues you just presented.

Superman is a "champion of the oppressed", which would lead to him being more pro helping people who the progressives *claim* to want to help (notice the * when you read that). Once again, he represents an ideal, not what is actually factual.

Sea Speed said:

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Of course that all coincides with trump 45 and the political left getting up in arms about immigration. Surely that was just happenstance.

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Movie was written like three years ago

the most cool guy said:

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Quad Dog said:

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Superman is a character created by two second generation Jewish immigrants in 1938.

He has always been a reflection of whatever modern society needed him to be and an allegory for modern issues for 87 years.

Literally in his first comic he fights a wife beater and a crooked Senator. The "American Way" saying was added in 1952 for the original TV show during the Red Scare. His radio show helped fight the KKK. Silver Age Superman was even more progressive. He wrote on the Moon for all to see "Do good to others and every man can be a Superman."

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Let's take these in order.

1. The overwhelming majority of so-called "progressives" in this country are utterly anti-Jewish, and it's not even debatable.

2. The overwhelming majority of so-called "progressives" in this country fully supported a male violently beating the **** out of a woman in a boxing ring, just because said male decided that he was a woman in his mind.

3. The so-called "progressives" in this country willingly put members of the Clinton family and the Biden family up as candidates in the last three presidential elections. I don't need to go through the full list because Burisma and the Clinton Foundation alone have exemplified more obvious corruption out of so-called "progressives" than we have ever seen out of anyone on the other side of the aisle.

4. So-called "progressives" in this country are the only ones openly advocating for race-based discrimination, and the party of the so-called "progressives" is the one that founded the KKK.

5. So-called "progressives" in this country are the driving force behind cancel culture: if a person sins against the arbitrary moving target of leftist ideals, they are not treated with dignity and no good is done to them. They are ostracized, humiliated, threatened, and insulted until the mob grows tired and moves on. There is no forgiveness in modern so-called "progressivism." Also, modern so-called "progressivism" is morally relativistic. There is no foundation for such a thing as "good" or "evil." Good has no meaning beyond whatever is politically expedient for the "progressive" agenda. There can be no "good" done because what is "good" is fluid and therefore meaningless.

Nothing about Superman has anything to do with modern so-called "progressivism."

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Let's take these in order:

1. Please don't ruin this thread. If you really want to debate modern views of party vs party take it somewhere else, because there is no way this ends with the thread being readable. You're going from debating meaning or intent to straight politics.

I get that there is probably going to be debate around the film, but at this point we have no idea what is or isn't in the film so let's at least wait to cross that bridge when we come to it.