A $500,000,000 convention center, for starters.

A ball park for Uri Geva.... I can go on, but if you are so blind to not notice the dissent you get for spending taxpayers' money woefully, then there is no point.

Diddler_44 said:

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A $500,000,000 convention center, for starters.

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It's an event center, not a convention center. Albeit conventions can be held at it.

Not going to happen unless TAMUs, TAMU, CoB, County and CS all want it.

I support taking it to the citizens for a vote.

Not $500m. That's inclusive of a hotel, which the private sector would build. With multiple entities participating it's very doable. If they don't, it's not.

Respectfully

Yancy '95

Diddler_44 said:

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A ball park for Uri Geva.... I can go on, but if you are so blind to not notice the dissent you get for spending taxpayers' money woefully, then there is no point.

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Not for the Bombers. The Bombers are but one tenant user of the facility. Not just for baseball. The championship field is a multi-sport facility.

And finally, "dissent" is what you saw when we last tried to change pebble creek parkway. Dissent is what you saw the county just go through with the east loop. There's been no dissent on the multi-sport championship field nor an events center save for roughly a half dozen dissenters here on Texags.

When more folks are against ball fields and an events center than are for it, that'd be actionable. That's not the case. You may of course dissent, but respectfully, that doesn't constitute broad citizen dissension.

Respectfully

Yancy '95

Its obvious that you only want to hear from people that support your agenda. I, for one, do not. I have to go feed my chickens. Have a great evening.

To be fair, you always use that line as some kind of empirical data when the reality is you haven't properly surveyed the constituents.

PS3D said:

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An expansion of Pebble Creek has been on the books for a while. When Corporate Parkway opened (the little road linking Midtown Drive and Highway 6 just south of what is now Christ Church) it was called Pebble Creek Parkway, as it was supposed to curve around Spring Creek back toward the highway.

I should say that there DOES need to be a real north-south thoroughfare in the eastern half of the county and not expect Highway 6 to do all the work, and kowtowing to every pearl-clutching resistance means we will end up like Austin (underbuilt and not able to contain growth). That being said, Pebble Creek Parkway DOES seem to have enough width for two lanes in each direction IF you take out the bike lane, giving it to 12-foot wide lanes on either side, which isn't overly generous but it's what Holleman Drive South has on it. The only section in question is around Muirfield Village where it does get a bit narrow but if you sacrifice the turning lane and add four feet of right of way that should address the most pressing issues. So the "cutting through the backyard" issue for Pebble Creek residents won't be a problem.

The big question is...where would it go? The south end could probably expand to Southern Pointe and give that a relief valve (probably taking over/renaming Pipeline Road behind it, which almost has certainly seen an increase in traffic in the last ten years). But of the north end? The whole thing COULD work with just following the power line right of way. Curve toward Rock Prairie Road, intersect it and continue north, behind Foxfire, behind Emerald Forest, plug in Spring Creek, expand the utility road that continues from North Forest Parkway, plug that in, part of Raintree will end up on the other side of the road...intersect Harvey Road...probably reroute Carter's Creek there...intersect University Drive, and then see if you could hook it up to Wildflower in Bryan somehow, add a multi-use path, and now you have a nice 11-mile road to serve local traffic and take traffic off of Highway 6.

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Practically everything you mentioned was around neighborhoods, not right through the middle of one. There is not enough to make two lanes comfortably. Especially since people will be doing 50 on that road. Right through the middle of the neighborhood. It's ridiculous.

Lakeway/Midtown is the better choice.

Thank you for your reply. I think there are better options than putting a thoroughfare through a major neighborhood. Especially when there is a better option using Lakeway with potential to develop businesses along that road. It can become similar to Rock Prairie.

TAMU1990 said:

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Pebble Creek Parkway is not wide enough for 4 lanes and a turn lane. Be honest how many times have you gone faster than 40 on Rock Prairie? This will be a road going 40 mph at a minimum with many drivers pushing 50.

Edit - that map wants it up to 6 lanes. Ridiculous.

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Use Google Earth or some other measurement tool and compare the northbound lanes of Holleman Drive South (a major thoroughfare) to the width of one of the sections of Pebble Creek Parkway, you will see that they are almost identical. If you take out the bike lane, there's your two lanes, and because it does tend to be on the narrower side, there's your answer to faster speeds, the William J. Bryan Parkway "re-do" was changed to attempt to force lower speeds by design.

TAMU1990 said:

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Lakeway/Midtown is the better choice.

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The second Lakeway is brought up as an alternative you'll have people complaining about how it's too close to Pebble Creek Elementary School, would involve cutting down trees, and then pretty useless since it abruptly ends back at the frontage road before even connecting to Rock Prairie Road.

I've learned a lot about traffic since being on council. I've noticed the experts don't always agree. Often times TxDoT and county/city experts don't agree. I also learned TxDoT doesn't like to do contested projects; that the cities have more sway than they perhaps realize; that the same people who tell you "but we've had that on our comp plan forever," will turn around and recommend against a proposed change to that very plan by citizens or other interests; that the MPO is very influential/powerful and can encumber funds to be spent locally that originate from the state; that disparate levels of govt often do projects without coordinating with one another. The list goes on.

I think our system is a good one, but citizen involvement in roadways is crucial.

Emphasis story: you know how people say the Vegas oddsmakers are genius? How they marvel at how close they call so many games? Well, it's not the oddsmakers that are genius. It's the people. The initial odds are set by the "experts" but then, the bets start pouring in and the odds change. That goes back and forth until a democratic (for lack of a better word) result is settled on. That's a metaphor for govt. The more we involve the bosses, the better the outcome. The lesser, the worse.

Respectfully

Yancy '95

Bob Yancy said:

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Emphasis story: you know how people say the Vegas oddsmakers are genius? How they marvel at how close they call so many games? Well, it's not the oddsmakers that are genius. It's the people. The initial odds are set by the "experts" but then, the bets start pouring in and the odds change. That goes back and forth until a democratic (for lack of a better word) result is settled on. That's a metaphor for govt. The more we involve the bosses, the better the outcome. The lesser, the worse.

Respectfully

Yancy '95

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Maybe share this story with city staff. You're preaching to the choir here.

maroon barchetta said:

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Bob Yancy said:

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Emphasis story: you know how people say the Vegas oddsmakers are genius? How they marvel at how close they call so many games? Well, it's not the oddsmakers that are genius. It's the people. The initial odds are set by the "experts" but then, the bets start pouring in and the odds change. That goes back and forth until a democratic (for lack of a better word) result is settled on. That's a metaphor for govt. The more we involve the bosses, the better the outcome. The lesser, the worse.

Respectfully

Yancy '95

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Maybe share this story with city staff. You're preaching to the choir here.

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or a select few "naysayers" .

No sir, what I personally do not do is make logical fallacies where I do things like-

Equate the attendance (which was grossly exaggerated by the way) of a city paying out of pocket to hold a free event on a national holiday to a one off event held at an iconic arena where an aging icon of country music played.

I want the CoCS to grow and succeed I have a ton of skin in that game. I want Aggie football to be relevant, I want both cities and the county in lockstep to make the entire Brazos valley vibrant and successful. As a taxpayer and small business owner I am highly motivated to root for that success. Hell I have done my absolute best to participate in creating that success by creating 80 jobs myself and contributing to the tax base.

As far as "no matter the points" comment, show me a winning situation I have spoken against? Better yet, show me some "points" I can root for, without using hypothetical fallacies.

I am unwilling to use "blue sky" as an excuse to waste tax payers money on what I see as either "highly risky", "outright poor decisions" or unnecessary, I guess we will have to agree to disagree on that.

Indicating that you see their desire to see citizens' resources to go toward privately directed projects rather than your pet projects as "betting against the home team" says a lot

I am kind of excited about the prospect of the Republican Party getting involved locally because this tax and spend mentality needs organized pushback

PS3D said:

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TAMU1990 said:

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Pebble Creek Parkway is not wide enough for 4 lanes and a turn lane. Be honest how many times have you gone faster than 40 on Rock Prairie? This will be a road going 40 mph at a minimum with many drivers pushing 50.

Edit - that map wants it up to 6 lanes. Ridiculous.

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Use Google Earth or some other measurement tool and compare the northbound lanes of Holleman Drive South (a major thoroughfare) to the width of one of the sections of Pebble Creek Parkway, you will see that they are almost identical. If you take out the bike lane, there's your two lanes, and because it does tend to be on the narrower side, there's your answer to faster speeds, the William J. Bryan Parkway "re-do" was changed to attempt to force lower speeds by design.

TAMU1990 said:

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Lakeway/Midtown is the better choice.

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The second Lakeway is brought up as an alternative you'll have people complaining about how it's too close to Pebble Creek Elementary School, would involve cutting down trees, and then pretty useless since it abruptly ends back at the frontage road before even connecting to Rock Prairie Road.

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I suggest you drive down PCP. The golf cart lane is slightly bigger than a bike lane. It's too tight to make two lanes. There are plenty of trees south of the dead end of PCP too.

Absolutely not - in fact, at the meeting at city hall it was suggested to use Lakeway and/or widen the existing road Rock Prairie that already goes to 6.

Aggie_Fire said:

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TAMU1990 said:

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PS3D said:

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TAMU1990 said:

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Pebble Creek Parkway is not wide enough for 4 lanes and a turn lane. Be honest how many times have you gone faster than 40 on Rock Prairie? This will be a road going 40 mph at a minimum with many drivers pushing 50.

Edit - that map wants it up to 6 lanes. Ridiculous.

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Use Google Earth or some other measurement tool and compare the northbound lanes of Holleman Drive South (a major thoroughfare) to the width of one of the sections of Pebble Creek Parkway, you will see that they are almost identical. If you take out the bike lane, there's your two lanes, and because it does tend to be on the narrower side, there's your answer to faster speeds, the William J. Bryan Parkway "re-do" was changed to attempt to force lower speeds by design.

TAMU1990 said:

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Lakeway/Midtown is the better choice.

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The second Lakeway is brought up as an alternative you'll have people complaining about how it's too close to Pebble Creek Elementary School, would involve cutting down trees, and then pretty useless since it abruptly ends back at the frontage road before even connecting to Rock Prairie Road.

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I suggest you drive down PCP. The golf cart lane is slightly bigger than a bike lane. It's too tight to make two lanes. There are plenty of trees south of the dead end of PCP too.

Absolutely not - in fact, at the meeting at city hall it was suggested to use Lakeway and/or widen the existing road Rock Prairie that already goes to 6.

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That's not a golf cart lane...that's supposed to be bike lane! LOL

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That's why all those people yell and dive out of the way! Now I get it! ;-)

If there is a need for a additional east roadway to have drivers avoid going down Hwy 6, maybe go from Fitch/Rock Prairie intersection south on RP and so down southwest on Peach Creek Road. Widen those to four lanes and you have another N/S route.

Another option might be extend Peach Creek Road to the Fitch/Hwy 30 intersection?

Extend Lakeway to Hwy 6?

I don't think it's wise to run a four lane throughfare down through the middle of an established subdivision.

I vote no on expanding more traffic on Pebble Creek Parkway. We have a hard enough time getting out on Fitch on a busy morning (no, we don't need more traffic lights). Sincerely, Spring Meadows homeowners.

The same thing is going to happen in Pebble Creek that happened in Castle Gate and Castle Gate II when Victoria was joined.
It's going to turn into a road where people disregard speed limits in a neighborhood and make turning off of side roads dangerous.

agmom95 said:

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I live off Royal Adelade Loop and work for CSISD so I travel these roads during peak times. The amount of golf carts traveling down Pebble Creek Parkway and the foot traffic for those going to the trails at Lick Creek Park would be enough to cause a pause and think through how this would safely work. I lived in Austin (on the northwest side near Lake Travis area for 25 years and know what increased traffic can do to a neighborhood area and also understand the implications of not solving traffic patterns correctly and safely. It's a tough spot. I did sign the petition as I am very concerned about my property value and the safety of such a project.

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I have a meeting scheduled with the developer of the new neighborhood. I'm interested to see their plan and hopefully craft a win-win-win for Pebble and them and our planners.

No one wants to see PC Parkway turn into a 4 lane speedway. I'm confident we can work something out. We'll roll up our sleeves and get after it.

Respectfully

Yancy '95

PS3D said:

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Use Google Earth or some other measurement tool and compare the northbound lanes of Holleman Drive South (a major thoroughfare) to the width of one of the sections of Pebble Creek Parkway, you will see that they are almost identical. If you take out the bike lane, there's your two lanes, and because it does tend to be on the narrower side, there's your answer to faster speeds, the William J. Bryan Parkway "re-do" was changed to attempt to force lower speeds by design.

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As someone who drives down the parkway daily, you're not (safely) squeezing in two cars after removing the bicycle/golf cart lane. I've been tempted many times to pass a retiree driving 25 mph down the parkway but there's no room.