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*** PLURIBUS *** (from Vince Gilligan, creator of Breaking Bad)

38,315 Views | 438 Replies | Last: 7 hrs ago by oragator
TexAgs91
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I think the one goal of earth now is to send instructions to create the virus out into space for the next civilization.

It's how this virus spreads.
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TexAgs91
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TCTTS said:

That episode was pure vibes, but man the vibes were immaculate. Carol having that fancy dinner alone, the beautiful skyline in the background… Manousos's road trip, with all of those stunning shots… just… wow. Manousos using the opportunity to learn English was so smart too, especially in the way it culminated with the line he kept repeating to himself as motivation. Felt very "My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die." That, and I'm so curious to see *who* Carol is now, once Manousos finally arrives. Not is-she-one-of-them, but has her hatred for/fervor to cure them dissipated enough that there's now going to be some drama there?

Only two episodes left! Can't wait!


This is what I actually don't like about Vince Gilligan (and Better Call Saul). Yes, there's only 2 episodes left. And if you had to say what happened in the first half of the last episode you'd be at a loss for words. Basically nothing happened for half the episode.

And the episode before that could be summarized in one sentence.

I'd be ok with vibes once in a while if I knew the end of the season wasn't coming fast followed by a wait of a year or maybe more.

I think I, and others on this thread can already see what the season finale will be.
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Seven Costanza
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I love the cinematography of this show and the themes that it is exploring. It might be the only thing I've watched this year where I'm not checking how much time is left every 5-10 minutes. My one small complaint, and I'll need to wait until the next two episodes to fully judge it, is that the story has not developed as much I would like. I understand that the alien "virus" is just a vehicle to evaluate life/society, but I'd like to see the story advance just a little more. Hopefully they move it along a bit in the final two episodes. And of course, any minor criticism will be met with "not enough explosions for you?" or "you don't understand, that's a feature not a bug..."
Gaius Rufus
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I wouldn't be at a loss for words of what happened for the first 20 minutes of the episode. If you think about it, it actually went kind of fast. The first 7 episodes has been Carol fighting the hive mind and trying to convince herself, and them, that she didn't need or want them in her life.

In about 20-30 minutes (ep was 46 minutes and I'm not sure how much total time they spend on Manousos) we see Carol spend a month living alone, her only contact with other humans via a recorded voice message.

We see her break down in real time and accept some of what Diabate suggested, then we see her fully accept that she doesn't actually want to be alone. She did all the things she didn't have time for in the old world. She got to act out against the hive mind. She got to relive special memories she had of Susan, because of the hive mind.

To me, that was a pretty short amount of time to put a whole month into. I'm not sure how they could have done that faster without it not being in character for Carol.
BQRyno
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Another interesting aspect I haven't seen mentioned specifically is that after realizing she didn't want to be alone, she must have also realized that the collective she so despises is more likely to agree to fill that need than the other remaining humans. She didn't reach out again to them to ask for companionship (even via zoom call) because she had learned from Diabate that they aren't interested in having her around. Instead, she'll take what she can get, and it's good enough.
TexAgs91
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Yeah, I get what happened, and to put what I said above another way, I'd be fine with it if I were watching the series after it had been completed.

But when these vibe episodes come, I'm just thinking about how they're slow rolling the rest of the season to leave us with Manousos appearing at her door step, and then end credits and a year long wait.

Hopefully that event happens but we get more that we weren't expecting, otherwise it's like the season has already ended and we're just watching everything we knew of at the end of the episode before last play out for 3 episodes.
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Gaius Rufus
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Gotcha. Yeah, that makes sense. I agree I would love to see the coming conflict with Manousos this season as more than just a cliffhanger in the last episode.

I like the analysis posited early, about how Zosia was walking foreshadowing a pregnancy, and I would love to see a fleshed out reaction from both Carol and Manousos to that this season, if it is indeed what is happening.
tk for tu juan
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Bella Donna was painted in 1939… it is a sign
rynning
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The official podcast for episode 7 is good. Talks about the production aspects of course which is interesting, but also about the different places that Carol and Manousos are mentally. Carol asks the hive to turn on pump 1, while Manousos is literally swallowing gasoline.
TCTTS
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TexAgs91 said:

Yeah, I get what happened, and to put what I said above another way, I'd be fine with it if I were watching the series after it had been completed.

But when these vibe episodes come, I'm just thinking about how they're slow rolling the rest of the season to leave us with Manousos appearing at her door step, and then end credits and a year long wait.

Hopefully that event happens but we get more that we weren't expecting, otherwise it's like the season has already ended and we're just watching everything we knew of at the end of the episode before last play out for 3 episodes.


I'm more and more convinced that Carol and Manousos are going to clash at first. When Carol made the video that Manousos finally watched, she hated the Others just as much as Manousos. The only difference was, her hatred was partly expressed by making them do her bidding (thus being in contact with them) while Manousos flat out refused contact. Carol also needed to engage the Others in order to study them and thus try to find a way to reverse the virus. Manousos was trying in his own way (scanning the radio stations), but again, in utter solitude. Still, Carol and Manousos' hatred/goals were the same.

Now?

Manousos is going to show up (my guess at some point in the second half of the next episode), only to find a different Carol than the one in the video. A somewhat defeated Carol. An exhausted Carol. A Carol who has found a way to tolerate the Others/co-exist with them in her own way… which is almost assuredly not going to sit well with Manousos.

IF that ends up being the case, Gilligan likely isn't going to save that clash for season two. Or, rather, we'll at least see the beginnings of their clash play out this season, and then maybe see the rest of it over the first few episodes of next season. I say this because that clash is too juicy, and lends itself too much to Carol's character arc this season, to be paused then resolved next season. In other words, any cliffhanger is more likely to be plot centric, not mid-character-arc centric, if that makes sense.

We need to see the "cost" of Carol "choosing" the Others THIS season, through Manousos's eyes, for any of this to pay off in satisfying fashion, and for her to be able to come full circle before the season ends.

Think of it this way… essentially, the job of a writer is to play God to your characters, testing their moral fortitude by throwing challenge after challenge at them, ultimately having them come out the other end a changed person. And right now, to that end, it appears to me as if Gilligan is testing Carol's RESOLVE. She's too lonely and too desperate to keep fighting, to keep rallying, to keep trying to find a cure. So she gives in and accepts the Others, if only because of how much she needs that hug, even though she almost assuredly still begrudges them deep down.

That said, if you had to name one, what is the one quality Manousos represents above all? What did half of this episode spend underlining emphatically? Because I would say it's, not coincidentally… his RESOLVE. In other words, thematically speaking, Manousos is Carol's resolve marching across half the planet to get to her, and then she's ultimately going to have to choose whether to embrace that resolve again or not. And my point is, I don't think Gilligan is going to save that choice for season two. IMO, in this scenario, the better season one "cliffhanger" is Carol finally "waking" from her stupor to embrace Manousos' mission/point-of-view - to embrace her RESOLVE again - and then, at THAT point, we cut to black, so to speak, heading into season two.

Then again, seeing as I'm not nearly as seasoned as Gilligan when it comes to this stuff, maybe he has something even better planned. I'm not saying I'm right - chances are I'm wrong - but this is all my current read to the best of my expertise.
Gaius Rufus
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Great analysis. What if the new conflict for Carol is choosing between working with a Manousos to destroy the hivemind versus picking the hive mind because they used her frozen eggs to create a baby that they think/know she wants?

I imagine we get at least one more flashback to her time with Susan that may give us more info on why they never had kids.
Brad 98
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I still think Zoisa separates herself from the hive mind somehow before the season ends
G Martin 87
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Anagrammatic Nudist said:

There may be more to it, but I took the license plate as just a rich golfer's car that was left at the club when "the event" occurred. "ACE" referring to a hole-in-one. It's Gilligan so yeah, probably more to it, but I think most is a reach.
"ACEBABY" is just a pun on "Ice, Ice Baby" using "ace", which as mentioned before, is golfer slang for a hole-in-one. Carol got the Rolls at the Albuquerque Country Club. It's not any more complicated than that.
AJ02
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Prior to this episode, I wondered if they'd actually take us through the Darien Gap. Glad to see they did.

As for the spikes covered in bacteria....if they 100% cannot kill anything, doesn't that mean they can't administer antibiotics to kill Manouso's infection??


ACEBABY...my first thought was the new slang for "asexual". With Gilligan, I could see it intimating more than just "hole in one" golfer.
LB12Diamond
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Susan?
Gig ‘Em Baby!
Seven Costanza
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I wonder if the original idea in the brainstorming of the concept this show was something like "Imagine you were the last person on Earth, but there were humanoid robots that could do everything for you. You don't have to work. You can fly anywhere you want. Have a professional chef around the clock. Sleep with anyone. Any car you want. Have literally anything that you want. Would that make you happy?"
tk for tu juan
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The tagline was: "The most miserable person on Earth must save the world from happiness."

There is a Ringer TV interview back on page 5 where he discusses the initial development of the show
DG-Ag
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I'll probably get roasted here for this. I like but don't love this show. It's solidly in 3rd place for me in the Gilligan troika. BB way ahead in 1st place. BCS a few lengths behind. And this one definitely bringing up the rear. Will echo some of the thoughts on plot development. A lot of you on here appear to be true film school types. I'm definitely not that. "I don't know art, but I know what I like." This episode reminded me of "The Fly" episode of BB. Seemed like filler to me. Looking forward to the last 2 episodes to get me excited for season 2. Flame away!
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OldArmy71
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I also thought of "The Fly" episode.
normalhorn
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Ditto to "The Fly"

I also would rank this series solidly last in Gilligan's top showrunning. Partly due to the tiny amount of episodes to judge, and partly due to BB and BCS having had years to stick with me and continue to be appreciated so mightily while Pluribus hasn't earned the same respect yet

Also, I know it adds tension to the episodes, but, for sanity's sake, I sure hope that the voicemail greeting is shortened. Good grief, there's full minutes of each episode that are spent just on nothing else happening while the message is played ad nauseum, other than Carol scratching off lotto tickets
...take it easy on me, I'm a normal horn
Gaius Rufus
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I think the voicemail is done since she reconnected with the hive mind.
schmendeler
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My first request would have been to change the greeting to just a beep.
oragator
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No need to roast anyone, to each their own.
This series is following an emotional arc, not an action one. And it also doesn't have all of the characters people had over 10 seasons to get to know and appreciate from VG, we barely have half of one season. Along with a female lesbian lead. And that's not to say people are prejudiced against that, but all the male fans of VG may have a harder time relating to her.
So there are lots of legitimate reasons even VG fans wouldn't be in love with it.
For me, anytime there's a show that is unique and clearly well thought through (even if you aren't a fan of the plot), I gravitate to them. And this show has the tiny details, cinematography, and unique emotional basis that I think is great. But again, totally get how that isn't for everyone.
HelotesAg
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I believe the voice on that voicemail message is Howard from BCS. Anyone else notice that?
G Martin 87
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HelotesAg said:

I believe the voice on that voicemail message is Howard from BCS. Anyone else notice that?
Oooh, now that you mention it, yes! That does sound like Howard.
oragator
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I posted it up thread, but yeah that him.
Tobias Funke
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It is indeed Patrick Fabian's voice. They did it as a surprise to Seehorn too
AJ02
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HelotesAg said:

I believe the voice on that voicemail message is Howard from BCS. Anyone else notice that?


I said that exact thing to my husband last episode. Turns out we were both correct....it is him.
YouBet
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This show is only getting better IMO. Just great.

Agree with a couple of others that I think we are way overanalyzing the alien invasion angle. I also think it's just a vehicle to explore humanity. We may never even get any background on the why or how of their background or purpose.
tk for tu juan
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Technically the aliens have already invaded the bodies of over 7 billion humans and are forcing them into starvation. They went on the offensive to keep humans from invading their own planet in the future
dave94
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Tobias Funke said:

It is indeed Patrick Fabian's voice. They did it as a surprise to Seehorn too

This is why I never got tired of hearing the message. His voice is so calming and also Howard ended up being one of my favorite characters in BCS.
PDEMDHC
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schmendeler said:

My first request would have been to change the greeting to just a beep.


Houston Lee
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schmendeler said:

My first request would have been to change the greeting to just a beep.

I have been thinking that since the first airing of the voice message greeting. Ask the hive to shorten it..
snowaggie
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Houston Lee said:

schmendeler said:

My first request would have been to change the greeting to just a beep.

I have been thinking that since the first airing of the voice message greeting. Ask the hive to shorten it..

I gotta believe with Gilligan being Gilligan, this annoyance (and it's really driving me crazy) will pay off in the future as a crucial plot point or something of relevance.
Diggity
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Houston Lee said:

schmendeler said:

My first request would have been to change the greeting to just a beep.

I have been thinking that since the first airing of the voice message greeting. Ask the hive to shorten it..

agreed. It's like some sort of stubborn battle of wills with the main character not making that request.
 
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